"Old School" chivalery: Yea or Nay (Do you like it?)

[tma]

**NOTE: Please, please, please, please- let's keep this in *here* rather than Pit. *bats eyelashes* Ok. Thanks! **

Ok... Another thread got me thinking...(I know... shocking.. )

Anyway... I see myself as very modern and independent- and I absolutely *hate* being patronized.

That being said... I am a huge sap for the whole "old school" thing with some things. I went on a date once where the guy opened my door- my jaw probably hit the floor (at least it did in my mind )... and I did have a guy actually help me into my coat once and it just was...

Maybe it was the way that they did it- it wasn't being obnoxious- it was just sort of automatic. And neither patronized me at all.

I don't know... just wondering how people (particularly women) felt about this. If you like it or think that it is sweet, don't care either way, or don't really like it.

[Kiwifruit]

I love it xD I went out with a guy a couple of weeks ago who insisted on buying me lunch, held doors open for me, pulled out my chair and lightly placed his hand on my upper back or arm to guide me through doors or whatever...it was really nice xD And like you said, it wasn't patronising at all. So yea for me!

[Renee]

I like the old school way. I think it is very sweet of a man to do that. It shows that they are true gentlemen & know how to treat a woman right.

[EmeraldThread]

Like you, I absolutely love it. I think it shows that the guy was raised to respect not only women, but people in general. I guess in this case it would be predominantly that they know how to treat women, but it's like a novelty nowadays. I don't know if it's the same everywhere, but where I live, it's rare to find a real gentleman who will open your car door or do something so old-fashioned.

But it's kind of like the difference between cliche and classic, in my mind. Cliche is sort of frowned upon and overdone whereas classic is just the right amount of something that's been around just as long, or longer. I'm not sure how good that definition is, but it's sort of how I think of the gentlemanly type. And on your point of not being patronized, that's exactly how it should be. They're not treating you so far above standard that it's insulting, but it's just a form of respect and doing something nice for another person, particularly one who's so close to you.

So, in short, I think that kind of chivalry is awesome.

[•.*°•☆. Q .☆•°*.•]

I think that things like door-holding and check-getting and raincoat-over-apuddle-for-you-ing should be shared. Whoever gets to the door first should open it, and maybe check-get every other date or just whoevers' idea it was for the date gets the check. I think this way because I'm bi, and thinking about relationships with women it would be nice to have some of the "chivalry" too. I think everyone can do a bit of chivalry, it isn't just for men. It can be just as fun to pull out a date's chair as it is to have your own seat pulled out for you. Of course this isn't to say to get ridiculous about it, then both people would be getting up and down just pulling in and out chairs all night. Though I suppose some people are into that. Stranger things have happened after all.

I don't think I ever got around to actually giving a yea or nay in my last post. Sorry. Yea!

[sneezedreamer]

Like you, I absolutely love it. I think it shows that the guy was raised to respect not only women, but people in general. I guess in this case it would be predominantly that they know how to treat women, but it's like a novelty nowadays.

That's how I feel, too. Of course, there's a way to be patronizing about it and take it waaaay too far. But if such little gestures are done casually and with respect, then they're lovely!

I think that things like door-holding and check-getting and raincoat-over-apuddle-for-you-ing should be shared. Whoever gets to the door first should open it, and maybe check-get every other date or just whoevers' idea it was for the date gets the check. I think this way because I'm bi, and thinking about relationships with women it would be nice to have some of the "chivalry" too. I think everyone can do a bit of chivalry, it isn't just for men. It can be just as fun to pull out a date's chair as it is to have your own seat pulled out for you.

Well, I'm not bi, but I agree with you too! I think the same, exact way. Why shouldn't a woman hold a door open for a guy on occasion, or pull out a seat for her date, or even pay for a meal if they can afford to do so? I guess this is sort of a priority for me in relationships - I love it when guys take time out to do little things like that for me, but I firmly believe I should be allowed to do such things for them as well when the mood strikes. Relationships should be about mutual care and respect, after all...one person shouldn't be expected to "give" all the time and never "recieve".

Although...have to add...the whole raincoat over a puddle thing always seemed like a silly thing to do, no matter what your gender. Especially in those old movies where the girl could easily have just walked AROUND the puddle in the first place!

[murphy dee]

I'm a super sucker for the acts of gentlemen. I love 'em. I love having the door held for me, I love walking on a man's arm, I love being helped into/out of a coat, I love kisses on the backs of hands. It just makes me feel so feminine and delicate, which at my size is not something that happens very often.

[TheCakeIsAlive]

First: Yea. Second: can I add some reservations to that?

The handkissing is absolutely wonderful if done right, but I feel with the getting coat, picking up check (especially that one), holding open doors, it should be 50/50. I get uncomfortable very quickly when people do too much for me without me getting a chance to "even the scores" as it were. Besides, I'm too used to being the person holding open the door for other people (curtsy is optional). But I admit if it's an automatic thing to hold open the door and gesture "go ahead" it can be a very nice surprise and makes my day just a little bit better.

There is certainly a part of me who would love being taken out on a date by SO with the whole "handing coat, opening door, pull out chair"-thing... as long as I can do it back another time.

[tma]

omg- the puddle thing- you are absolutely right- that is Hysterical!

I definitely want to be able to reciprocate in my own way as well. For example- I wouldn't want to go with a guy who never let me pay- and I'm not sure about if they ordered for me- unless say it was once and they knew my tastes or wanted to share something new- but then I'd like the chance to get to pick out things another time. Although- I *don't* expect that type of thing- certainly not all the time and most definitely wouldn't be like a uni roomate of mine who said that she wouldn't date a guy who didn't do those things for her. I'm not some incapable weak person, and I'm most definitely not a princess that needs to be waited on hand and foot.

It's really odd- but certain things I would find really akward to do as woman for a guy (like opening car door *unless hands were full and was in passenger side*, or pulling out chair, or helping w/ coat)- but I do like the "female to the rescue" type of thing- (see "Practice Makes Perfect http://www.sneezefet...+makes +perfect"- lol - not a as a shameless plug for my writing... - I meant it more as a way to illustrate the type of "rescuing" that I like).

I ummm... sort of did that type of thing with my silly host teacher last fall. He was sick and sounded *horrible* but was just in total denial - like "la la la... regular day... my voice isn't completely hoarse to where it is squeaky and hurts other people to listen to" ). I sort of insisted that I was going to take over his last two blocks of math classes since I honestly didn't even think that he'd have a voice left by lunch time (I actually was technically done w/ student teaching... but... seriously- how can you let someone teach sounding like that? ). And... umm... got him throat lozenges and left them on his desk. Well... after handing him one on my way out the day before (when he sounded like Barry White). It was so cute- he was like, "Huh? What's that for?" So I told him that they worked really well on sore throats. And then he did the whole sort of hang head abashedly and he said, "Oh.. you noticed" lol!! And ummm... inside even though I really felt bad- I was sort of melting-ish.

[EmeraldThread]

The handkissing is absolutely wonderful if done right, but I feel with the getting coat, picking up check (especially that one), holding open doors, it should be 50/50. I get uncomfortable very quickly when people do too much for me without me getting a chance to "even the scores" as it were.

I agree. I'm not that big on hand kissing, though I'm not sure why. I mean, picking up a check and holding open doors is something I do for people already, so I wouldn't want the guy to be the only one ever doing those things. But I think because hand kissing is something I'd feel awkward reciprocating, it's something I'm not all that fond of having done to me. I wouldn't complain about it, it's a nice thing to do if the other person's so inclined, but it's not something I'd think to want done.

Oddly enough, when I hold doors open for guys at school and let them walk in before me, a lot of them look totally off guard, like it's ridiculously unconventional or something.

[AltoFairy]

Chivalry needs to not be dead. I absolutely love when guys have the soul enough to be nice once and awhile. There's this guy at my school who is just the most polite guy ever- he holds the door open for girls, actually thanks them when they do something, asks how their day is going...

Yea. Definately yay.

[elements]

LOVE Chivalry from a guy who also respects when I can take care of things myself, too.

[Demon327]

That is how I was tought to act. It is simply a matter of respect. As to the matter of picking up the check, if I am on a date with someone whom I am not in a long term committed realstionship then it is my responsibility to pick up the check. As I am in a long term monogomous relationship, I'll go 50/50 on that one. But I'll still get a door (car or building) pull out a seat or help her on with her coat. She grumbles, but i think deep down she likes the show of respect

[PetalsAndThorns]

I don't think there's anything wrong with chivalry when it's simply a matter of respect and the desire to treat a woman well.

But I personally want chivalry and respect to come to me because someone likes me and desires to do something nice for me. I don't want it connected to some obligation because I'm biologically female. I want the chance to be chivalrous back, and it would irk me if someone I was with wouldn't let me do that, because chivalry isn't 'supposed to be' my role. I'm homosexual, so I haven't run into this problem. I also identify as gender-queer, so it just generally irks me when the role of respect I get is focused upon my gender. But as long as the person is showing chivalry through an earnest desire to show respect and kindness and wouldn't object if I showed the same respect back then I think it's wonderful.

Another problem that tends to arise is that even if both I and a man understood that chivalry was mutual, there is always the potential for people around you to interpret it differently. And while other people's opinions shouldn't matter, it is simply an uncomfortable place to be for some women. At the same time, it's also just as disrespectful for women to snap at men just for suggesting it.

Ideally, it's good to check in with your partner. "Is it ok if I open doors for you?" "Yes please/No, that makes me uncomfortable/Yes, generally, but not right now."