SF Mobile Game (FREE) (alpha)

[SmokeyGhost]

 

You think being distributed as part of a sexually themed game doesn't diminish the value of the original work?  I guarantee the developers of that Nintendo game would disagree.  The argument "I only stole a little bit and that makes it okay" is equally laughable. 

Again, if it's such a minor thing, why not do it ethically and legally?  If you found someone to do your own art, you could get exactly what you wanted and have much more flexibility.  There are some really good anime artists who post here.  I'd bet you wouldn't have too much trouble at all.

 

 

[Saltide]

28 minutes ago, SmokeyGhost said:

 

You think being distributed as part of a sexually themed game doesn't diminish the value of the original work?  I guarantee the developers of that Nintendo game would disagree.  The argument "I only stole a little bit and that makes it okay" is equally laughable. 

Again, if it's such a minor thing, why not do it ethically and legally?

 

 

Measuring the impact on the value of the original work, in this case, means "whether the defendant's specific use of the work has significantly harmed the copyright owner's market," and also "whether such uses in general, if widespread, would harm the potential market of the original." (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use#4._Effect_upon_work.27s_value) 

The argument "I only stole a little bit and that makes it okay" is actually one of the four governing points in fair use. "In general, the less that is used in relation to the whole, the more likely the use will be considered fair" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fair_use#3._Amount_and_substantiality). Again I argue that the portion I used in relation to the size of the original work is small enough that it is fair use.

Why not pay a small amount to an artist? Maybe I will for adding future characters to the game. I am reluctant to go this way because I am already "losing" on this project (in the form of used time) and I am not gaining any money that I could use to pay an artist. Why not charge for the game? This project is intended as a small thing that I'd do on the side, in my spare time, and not have to worry about anything financial. I understand that most non-profit projects have to generate money to cover operating costs but I believe that I can keep costs down to a minimum on such a small project. Yes, of course my computer costs money, my Internet and electricity cost money but I had those already. This is a small, insignificant time-waster so I can do something for the community (yes, it really does benefit the community) that I enjoy.

[Saltide]

I should comment more on the issue of value:

I do not believe that my use reduces the potential for people to become consumers of the original game, nor does it negatively impact the developers' business. Another thing the courts consider (according to the same Wikipedia article) is whether the use can be considered a substitute for the original work. In no way is my game a substitute for the original work.

In any case, as the article mentions, burden of proof for impact on value is on the creator of the original work. 

[Kaze Wo Hiku]

As someone who works in the business I'll say this, if the creator you took the images from thinks they've been plagiarized they will issue a DMCA. The "fair use" only gets you so far. I know this from personal experience where a game I know made a copy of the "poptart cat" meme thing, using a donut and the creator asked them to remove it. 

[Saltide]

Just now, Kaze wo Hiku said:

As someone who works in the business I'll say this, if the creator you took the images from thinks they've been plagiarized they will issue a DMCA. The "fair use" only gets you so far. I know this from personal experience where a game I know made a copy of the "poptart cat" meme thing, using a donut and the creator asked them to remove it. 

Certainly. If I am issued a DMCA, I will comply by removing online copies of the game and refrain from uploading them again.

[SmokeyGhost]

This isn't a court room and you can state what you believe is fair use until you've written ten pages.  As someone who's been involved in a couple of actual, real cases like that I know you're mistaken.  But I also know I can't convince you of that.

I do ask you to consider what the consequences could be.  Because you're right, burden of proof is on the creator of the original work.  If Nintendo... and they probably won't, but if they discovered that images from one of their games to which they hold the copyright was being distributed here as pornography, their MASSIVE legal team would immediately send a notice to the site that hosts this forum.  That site would not be the least bit interested in entering that type of legal battle, and would simply claim that this forum had violated their TOS and immediately shut it down.  That would not be good for this community at all.

As someone who says he's a fan of my work, I ask that you look at it from that perspective as well.  Because when I see this, and I know that you could justify in your own mind coming along and grabbing one of my images thinking "well, he's done hundreds of images, I'm only taking one," and then you might photo shop out some of the words in one of my speech bubbles and maybe put something really racist in there, or really homophobic in there, or anything at all that I might not like and claim you're completely justified because you only took a small amount of my work and changed it enough that you don't feel it's a "substitute" for my original work... well it makes me not want to create art any more.  I know most people aren't like that and wouldn't do it so I'm going to keep on keeping on because most people are good people.  But if there was a way I could stop just you from viewing it, I definitely would.  I feel that strongly about this issue.

I don't mean to be overly harsh, and I know... I KNOW your intentions with this are good.  You just want to share something with the community.  But share something that's genuinely yours, not something you've taken from someone else.  I'll tell you this... I'm a big fan of a particular actress and I've used her images to do all kinds of projects... for myself.  And no one will ever see them but me.  Because I don't have the right to use her image in that way.  And even if I did legally, I wouldn't.  It's not the right thing to do.

[Saltide]

2 minutes ago, SmokeyGhost said:

This isn't a court room and you can state what you believe is fair use until you've written ten pages.  As someone who's been involved in a couple of actual, real cases like that I know you're mistaken.  But I also know I can't convince you of that.

I do ask you to consider what the consequences could be.  Because you're right, burden of proof is on the creator of the original work.  If Nintendo... and they probably won't, but if they discovered that images from one of their games to which they hold the copyright was being distributed here as pornography, their MASSIVE legal team would immediately send a notice to the site that hosts this forum.  That site would not be the least bit interested in entering that type of legal battle, and would simply claim that this forum had violated their TOS and immediately shut it down.  That would not be good for this community at all.

As someone who says he's a fan of my work, I ask that you look at it from that perspective as well.  Because when I see this, and I know that you could justify in your own mind coming along and grabbing one of my images thinking "well, he's done hundreds of images, I'm only taking one," and then you might photo shop out some of the words in one of my speech bubbles and maybe put something really racist in there, or really homophobic in there, or anything at all that I might not like and claim you're completely justified because you only took a small amount of my work and changed it enough that you don't feel it's a "substitute" for my original work... well it makes me not want to create art for ungrateful thieves any more.  I know most people aren't like that and wouldn't do it so I'm going to keep on keeping on because most people are good people.  But if there was a way I could stop just you from viewing it, I definitely would.

I don't mean to be overly harsh, and I know... I KNOW your intentions with this are good.  You just want to share something with the community.  But share something that's genuinely yours, not something you've taken from someone else.  I'll tell you this... I'm a big fan of a particular actress and I've used her images to do all kinds of projects... for myself.  And no one will ever see them but me.  Because I don't have the right to use her image in that way.  And even if I did legally, I wouldn't.  It's not the right thing to do.

It may not seem like it but I really do respect your opinion, therefore I will get in contact with the staff here on SFF and if they agree with you, I will remove this thread for the purpose of preventing any legal issues. I still believe that my game should be considered fair use so I will continue to provide access for anyone who requests, off of the forums obviously. Thanks again for your input.

[Kiaory]

@Saltide

Ok, so, I thought I'd post some feedback based on my first time playing. I was going to do it this morning, but I lost the post due to technical difficulties and didn't feel like re-typing it until now. I'm writing this because I got the impression you wanted feedback, if this isn't helpful or you'd prefer to hear something else please just let me know.

• When you start the stopwatch app, a little 'made with unity' logo pops up before it loads. Doesn't bother me, bit it does seem like it might give the secret away, since unity is typically used to make games.
• When you use the feather tool, you need to wiggle the feather over the girl's nose. This means that it's hard to see her facial expression since, well, your finger is in the way.
• I'd suggest either moving the percentage bar to the other half of the screen or making it larger. As-is, it's right underneath where someone right-handed would put their thumb if they were playing the game and holding the phone with one hand. (Why would someone playing this game need a hand free? I have no intention of answering. )
• I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure a sneeze sound effect plays without an on-screen sneeze in one of the animations taken from that youtube animation. The video shows the girl sneezing twice, but there are three sneeze sounds.
• I really like how the second girl's pose/animation changes when you get her meter to 100%. If you have the art assets, would it be possible to implement something similar for the other characters? Or maybe a different set of sneeze sounds...

I'm a little hesitant to ask about my biggest request/reaction, since I don't know how it fits into your vision, but... Will we be seeing in increase in challenge, I guess you'd call it? Or maybe gameplay is a better word. School of Sneezes was an actual game with puzzle elements since you needed to figure out the right combination and order of items for each girl. Here you've got essentially an interactive animation, not a game. Which is still great, but an actual game would be cool if you were planning to go in that direction. I could try and thing up some suggestions for mechanics, if you're interested. 

As for scenario ideas... maybe waking up someone sleeping by making them sneeze? You'd just need them to start out with their eyes closed, and a background that made it look like they were lying down.

PS: I'm also part of the team working on the game started by @Guy. Would you be interested in sharing notes, as it were? We've also got an artist on the team, so working together might help some of your art issues. 

[SmokeyGhost]

 

Saltide's answer sounds fair to me.

 

And I'm thrilled to hear Kiaory got an artist!!!!

 

 

[Saltide]

6 minutes ago, Kiaory said:

@Saltide

Ok, so, I thought I'd post some feedback based on my first time playing. I was going to do it this morning, but I lost the post due to technical difficulties and didn't feel like re-typing it until now. I'm writing this because I got the impression you wanted feedback, if this isn't helpful or you'd prefer to hear something else please just let me know.

• When you start the stopwatch app, a little 'made with unity' logo pops up before it loads. Doesn't bother me, bit it does seem like it might give the secret away, since unity is typically used to make games.
• When you use the feather tool, you need to wiggle the feather over the girl's nose. This means that it's hard to see her facial expression since, well, your finger is in the way.
• I'd suggest either moving the percentage bar to the other half of the screen or making it larger. As-is, it's right underneath where someone right-handed would put their thumb if they were playing the game and holding the phone with one hand. (Why would someone playing this game need a hand free? I have no intention of answering. )
• I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure a sneeze sound effect plays without an on-screen sneeze in one of the animations taken from that youtube animation. The video shows the girl sneezing twice, but there are three sneeze sounds.
• I really like how the second girl's pose/animation changes when you get her meter to 100%. If you have the art assets, would it be possible to implement something similar for the other characters? Or maybe a different set of sneeze sounds...

I'm a little hesitant to ask about my biggest request/reaction, since I don't know how it fits into your vision, but... Will we be seeing in increase in challenge, I guess you'd call it? Or maybe gameplay is a better word. School of Sneezes was an actual game with puzzle elements since you needed to figure out the right combination and order of items for each girl. Here you've got essentially an interactive animation, not a game. Which is still great, but an actual game would be cool if you were planning to go in that direction. I could try and thing up some suggestions for mechanics, if you're interested. 

As for scenario ideas... maybe waking up someone sleeping by making them sneeze? You'd just need them to start out with their eyes closed, and a background that made it look like they were lying down.

PS: I'm also part of the team working on the game started by @Guy. Would you be interested in sharing notes, as it were? We've also got an artist on the team, so working together might help some of your art issues. 

Thanks so much for your feedback!

• Unfortunately this is required in Unity Personal edition projects. Yes, Unity is generally used for games, but it's actually not unheard of to use it for other cross-platform projects.
• Good point.
• I'll consider making an option to move the percent bar to either side of the screen.
• I am aware of the issue with extra sneezes. Not really sure what's going on there but I'll keep looking into it.
• That specific pose was only available for that character but there are a few special poses for other characters. 

I'll keep this in mind as I'm pretty open to the direction of the project. Thanks for all your great suggestions!

I'd love to help! I actually reached out to @Guy recently through Skype but haven't received a response yet. I would have PM'd him on the forums but it seems he has messaging disabled or lacks permissions.

[Kiaory]

2 minutes ago, Saltide said:

Thanks so much for your feedback!

• Unfortunately this is required in Unity Personal edition projects. Yes, Unity is generally used for games, but it's actually not unheard of to use it for other cross-platform projects.
• Good point.
• I'll consider making an option to move the percent bar to either side of the screen.
• I am aware of the issue with extra sneezes. Not really sure what's going on there but I'll keep looking into it.
• That specific pose was only available for that character but there are a few special poses for other characters. 

I'll keep this in mind as I'm pretty open to the direction of the project. Thanks for all your great suggestions!

I'd love to help! I actually reached out to @Guy recently through Skype but haven't received a response yet. I would have PM'd him on the forums but it seems he has messaging disabled or lacks permissions.

No problem! ^^

Would you like me to PM you a link to the project's discord room? It'd be a faster way to discuss this stuff than using the thread.

Also... looking back at the list, there's one piece of feedback I forgot about:

• Would it be possible to include a mute option in the menu? I'd be way to embarrassed to play this on speakers, and it'd be nice to have an option other than messing with the master volume on my phone or finding a pair of earbuds.

[Saltide]

Just now, Kiaory said:

No problem! ^^

Would you like me to PM you a link to the project's discord room? It'd be a faster way to discuss this stuff than using the thread.

Also... looking back at the list, there's one piece of feedback I forgot about:

• Would it be possible to include a mute option in the menu? I'd be way to embarrassed to play this on speakers, and it'd be nice to have an option other than messing with the master volume on my phone or finding a pair of earbuds.

I'll consider that too. Thanks again!

Yes please send me the discord link and I'll join it later today.

[bben9-kun]

You man I've read over and over bruh and it's just too difficult for me man i'm left out.... T_T 

[TheFetishPony]

I've tried everything I can think of. It always stops responding at the exact same point. I have no idea how to get it to install

Can somebody explain how to install it from Windows 10 to iPhone 5s?

[Saltide]

3 hours ago, bben9 said:

You man I've read over and over bruh and it's just too difficult for me man i'm left out.... T_T 

Hi bben, I'd like to help you but first I need to know what kind of phone you're trying to install on. Is it an iPhone or Android?

 

1 hour ago, TheFetishPony said:

I've tried everything I can think of. It always stops responding at the exact same point. I have no idea how to get it to install

Can somebody explain how to install it from Windows 10 to iPhone 5s?

Okay, so the Cydia program stops responding when you're trying to use it. Could you give some details about exactly what point it stops responding? Are you able to enter your Apple information and begin installing the app, or does it stop responding even before that step?

[TheFetishPony]

1 hour ago, Saltide said:

Hi bben, I'd like to help you but first I need to know what kind of phone you're trying to install on. Is it an iPhone or Android?

 

Okay, so the Cydia program stops responding when you're trying to use it. Could you give some details about exactly what point it stops responding? Are you able to enter your Apple information and begin installing the app, or does it stop responding even before that step?

This's what happens.

[Saltide]

15 minutes ago, TheFetishPony said:

This's what happens.

First I'd recommend unzipping the Impactor files so they're in a regular folder instead of the zip file that they're downloaded in. I've heard that programs don't always work properly if they're in a zipped folder. If that doesn't work, try using an older version of the program like 0.9.40 linked in this Reddit post - they reported that worked for them.

[TheFetishPony]

No, I get this error: https://imgur.com/a/t0JNa

[TheFetishPony]

*Now

[Saltide]

12 minutes ago, TheFetishPony said:

No, I get this error: https://imgur.com/a/t0JNa

Did you unzip the downloaded file? It appears zipped from the screenshot

[TheFetishPony]

Now this happened: https://imgur.com/a/t0JNa

[Saltide]

5 minutes ago, TheFetishPony said:

Now this happened: https://imgur.com/a/t0JNa

Close all the Impactor windows. Redownload the latest version of Impactor from the official website. Unzip all of the files in the downloaded zip file. This is easiest with Windows file explorer because you can just click the big Extract All button and it will automatically open the folder with the newly extracted files when it's done. Then run Impactor from this folder and try again. I think the first issue you had was because it wasn't extracted and the other issues were from trying to extract it while it was still running... just a guess

[TheFetishPony]

Now it just stops working. Same as in the video I posted prior.

 

I've been trying for hours to get this to work  

[Saltide]

1 minute ago, TheFetishPony said:

Now it just stops working. Same as in the video I posted prior.

 

I've been trying for hours to get this to work  

Yeah sorry I'm out of ideas aside from try restarting your computer, that has been known to work miracles from time to time

[TheFetishPony]

Just now, Saltide said:

Yeah sorry I'm out of ideas aside from try restarting your computer, that has been known to work miracles from time to time

I'll try that then